Planning Advisory Service (PAS) Logo
Planning Advisory Service (PAS)
Ouvert | En cours - juillet 2012 | Dernière modification - Aujourd'hui

What counts towards the housing supply?

Former Member, modifié il y a 10 années.

What counts towards the housing supply?

Hi

This query relates to paras 37 and 38, Ref ID:3-037-20140306 of the NPPG.

So I can now count C2 uses within my housing figure, which is a bonus for LAs like mine, who are struggling to make ends meet!

My first question relates to when I can count C2 contributions from. Should it be everything going forward from the publication of the NPPG or can I look back to commitments and completions from the start of my Plan period (2011)?

Secondly, student accommodation can also be used as a contribution towards the supply figure, including communal halls of residence. Has anyone raised the issue of C4 (HMOs) contributing towards the supply figure? Surely these units offer the same level of accommodation as Halls, with some private and some communal living spaces.

Any clarification would be welcomed.

Alison

Daniel Hudson, modifié il y a 10 années.

What counts towards the housing supply?

Advocate Publications: 121 Date d'inscription: 25/04/12 Publications Récentes

My view would be that  if C2 uses count towards meeting housing needs - and it is now clear that they do - there is no reason to understate your housing delivery figure by excluding C2 completions from the beginning of  the plan period. What would be the logic for so doing?

Ian McDonald, modifié il y a 10 années.

What counts towards the housing supply?

Enthusiast Publications: 70 Date d'inscription: 15/05/12 Publications Récentes

I am waiting to see what the Government's Housing Flow Reconciliation form looks like for the year ending 31 March 2014 as they should address this in the light of the NPPG.  To answer Alison's question I would have thought that you would need to record C2 completions since the beginning of the plan period.  This would mean amending (or upsetting) the previous years already recorded in the AMR and elsewhere...

Ian McDonald, modifié il y a 9 années.

RE: What counts towards the housing supply?

Enthusiast Publications: 70 Date d'inscription: 15/05/12 Publications Récentes
Alison - how are you counting C2 completions?  Have you seen this forum post https://khub.net/group/planningadvisoryservicepas/forum/-/message_boards/message/9185644?p_p_auth=mv9AofSt?
Andrew Chalmers, modifié il y a 9 années.

RE: What counts towards the housing supply?

Advocate Publications: 169 Date d'inscription: 20/10/11 Publications Récentes

There is further information from DCLG on definitions which may assist you at:

https://www.gov.uk/definitions-of-general-housing-terms

Information they supply as part of completing the Housing Flows Reconciliation Form would also assist.  My understanding from past conversations with CLG is that HMOs do count and should be recorded.  But you need to take full account of advice around self-containment and how these properties are taken into account by the Valuation Office.  So an HMO for 6 people is only 1 property.  This applies to the correct recording of student accomodation as well.  Does the VO regard these as separate self contained units, cluster flats or simply a hall of residence.  In the case of the first two of these, they can count, a hall of residence as with a nursing home does not.  Straight communal accommodation such as a nursing home or student hall is not included within your annual net completion figures and therefore not within your AMR figures in terms of general housing supply.

Of course this advice does not appear to be fully in line with NPPG and the guidance is silent on how to actually count numbers, so some ambiguity will remain...communal accommodation is not included in net completions but it can be included within the assessment of supply in local plans.  I would return to the CLG return for the more detailed view and that places weight on how the VO has listed a property be it a student hall or care home.  Clearly there is a planning argument that communal accommodation will have met needs for conventional housing.  I suspect the bottom line in this is you will not be able to defend a land supply position which has relied too much on "unconventional" housing such as care homes or student halls when challenged about delivery of "more normal" market housing. 

Andrea King, modifié il y a 9 années.

RE: What counts towards the housing supply?

Enthusiast Publications: 76 Date d'inscription: 19/08/13 Publications Récentes

There's another thread on "Is it appropriate to count 100% of C2 uses towards your OAN?" at https://khub.net/group/planningadvisoryservicepas/forum/-/message_boards/message/9181517?p_p_auth=BjVngEIs

My view on the communal accommodation aspect is that a bedroom in a care home, etc. (regardless of shared facilities like kitchen, living areas, etc.) still serves as providing for what is effectively a single-person household, which would suggest that each bedroom should be counted towards housing numbers and thereby reducing the number of households needing new dwellings. As said in that other thread, even if a couple are having to live separately, one at their family home and one in a care home, and particularly if that's an ongoing/permanent situation rather than one just temporarily living in the care home, then they're both effectively living as separate households regardless of still being a couple, each having their own separate housing accommodation needs.

Daniel Hudson, modifié il y a 9 années.

RE: What counts towards the housing supply?

Advocate Publications: 121 Date d'inscription: 25/04/12 Publications Récentes
An issue to beware of on this one is the issues of C2 uses which may have ceased , or are likely to cease, during the plan period. If you have boarding schools, hospitals or other institutional residential uses which have closed, or are likely to close (which up until now, you might have thought of as a pure windfall) you may need to consider your approach to accounting for any accommodation lost. 
Andrew Chalmers, modifié il y a 9 années.

RE: What counts towards the housing supply?

Advocate Publications: 169 Date d'inscription: 20/10/11 Publications Récentes
I would always go back to council tax records which I presume most authorities have ready access to and which is specifically referred to as a source of information in DCLG returns.  For most of these C2 uses it will perhaps only list one address.  I would be very reluctant to go down the line of trying to argue that institutional uses which are not self contained should be counted on an individual room basis both for removal or new build.
Jonathan Pheasant, modifié il y a 9 années.

RE: What counts towards the housing supply?

Advocate Publications: 158 Date d'inscription: 23/05/11 Publications Récentes

I've been thinking about this recently too.

If you read paras 37 and 38 there are subtle differences in the wording. I don't know whether this is deliberate or whether it's just bad consistency in the PPG.

Para 37 (C2) talks about counting C2/resi institutions AGAINST your REQUIREMENT. Then it says you could allocate sites. So this is really talking about NEED? It is certainly talkign about allocating sites.

On the other hand Para 38 (Stundents) uses a different wording saying that ALL student accommodation can be counted TOWARDS the housing REQUIREMENT.

This inconsistency makes it very confusing. Is the use of 'against' and 'towards' deliberate?

My only thoughts are that whatever you do you are measuring how many new homes/dwellings are provided against and objectively assessed need. So you need to count NET and include losses. Therefore if you have a C2 institution demolished/lost during the plan period then you count it as a loss. If you are goign to argue that every single bedroom in a C2 is equivalent to one dwelling as a gain to the stock, then you have to do the same for losses.

On student accommodation the PPG is a bit clearer and I'd say that you could look at student sharing rates in the private rental market. Say, for example the average student house has 3 students in it, then if you get new halls built you could count 1 dwelling for every 3 beds? That would sound logical. Student accommodation is also often provided as cluster flats now so you could count 1 cluster as 1 dwelling.

It's all a bit messy really and the PPG has not helped to clear up the detail other than to say you can count these types of development (I think)!!

 

Andrew Chalmers, modifié il y a 9 années.

RE: What counts towards the housing supply?

Advocate Publications: 169 Date d'inscription: 20/10/11 Publications Récentes

It is a muddled situation and I am pretty sure that the differences in terminology are purely sloppy drafting.  It is clear from DCLG HFR returns that cluster flats and self contained accommodation for both the elderly and student count as net new dwellings against that target in your plan.  Communal accommodation (subject to council tax analysis) does not.  Unfortunately the form then adds the ambiguity that "all student accommodation and housing for older people can be included in the assessment of supply in local plans, regardless of whether it is communal or on or off campus".

One suggestion I have is that everyone who has an issue with what it means uses the feedback facility in the NPPG to get DCLG to actually offer real guidance on this, or maybe this is an issue that PAS could explore?  Sadly the helpful advice I got last time I asked DCLG was yes all student accommodation can be included, but nothing on how!

Maybe there is a real need in this debate to step right back and ask ourselves what we are really planning for and then devise appropriate monitoring systems rather than wasting too much more time going round in circles to resolve the ambiguity that DCLG has created. In simple terms planning is about establishing the housing needs of all groups including the elderly and students, and then setting out how provision would be made.  So if a need for the elderly is going to arise, how much is going to be for communal accommodation compared with self contained models?  And how will this be delivered.  This is true also for students, although of course the accommodating of students within conventional housing makes this an interesting one to resolve. Logically then the idea of roughly how many students per house/flat could be factored in.

I suppose the issue with all this is that arguments have traditionally taken place around delivery of general private sector housing but not differentiated to such a degree.  The process of deriving an overall housing target is already very assumption laden and this would be even more so in deriving separate targets for those who may live in communal accommodation. 

I certainly agree that methodologically you need to be consistent in counting gains and losses to communal stock.